[Users] Deleting one long thread

Ralf Hutter rhutter at posteo.de
Wed Sep 30 16:11:54 CEST 2015

Am Wed, 30 Sep 2015 09:38:46 -0400
schrieb Pierre Fortin <pf at pfortin.com>:

> On Wed, 30 Sep 2015 14:14:51 +0200 Francis Moreau wrote:
> >ok, my last try: 
> Somehow, I'm not convinced...
> >imagine your summary window has a lot of different
> >threads. You want to delete the old ones, let say 10 of them. Isn't
> >more convenient to colapse all threads, then select the ones you want
> >to supprim then press SUPPR and you're done ?
> ...and many newcomers to CM start complaining that hitting ONE key
> deleted MANY IMPORTANT emails.  NOT what THEY were expecting...  How
> would you propose the current devs handle those complaints?
> How to do what you want/need has been pointed out.  You seem to have
> enough skills to understand your "problem", the workaround/fix, and
> how to use it...  Not everything in CM will make sense to you; but
> sometimes choices were made long ago by devs who are no longer here. 
> I LOVE CM. Used it for nearly 14 years (since Sylpheed-claws days) and
> have nothing but respect for the WONDERFUL devs who work hard to make
> SC/CM the BEST MUA they can, mostly for their own use and simply for
> the joy of it.  The fact that WE (normal users) get to enjoy their
> generous efforts is awesome.  
> I too had a few back and forth discussions with devs in the past; but
> this barrage of:  is too! is not! is too! is not! is too! is not! is
> too! is not! is too! is not! is too! is not! is too! is not! is
> getting OLD! Each response (either way) should contain something
> usefully new, or not be sent.
> >What is the *default* behaviour in this case ? after selecting the
> >old threads you want to delete, you press SUPPR and .... tada...
> >only the root of each thread is deleted... wonderful !
> This is how I interpret your real, unstated point: you expect someone
> else to come to the same conclusion as you, make it the default, and
> more importantly save you the "trouble" of actively choosing to enable
> something potentially dangerous...  All without considering
> ramifications you missed or deny; such as...
> To a NEW user, [s]he would a) not realize this was a "problem", b)
> wipe brow with a "PHEW! That was close!" -- silently being thankful
> for not losing a whole thread, c) eventually realize one-at-a-time is
> slow & ask about it, get a solution [for the more expert user], and
> USE it...
> >BTW, this is also true for others operations such as copy, move etc..
> Same reasoning applies here...  Ever "accidentally" drag a LARGE
> folder to another location?  Watching & waiting until it completes,
> knowing the pain will be doubled when you want to put it back...
> My point is that some defaults are intended to avoid the OPPOSITE rant
> chains... er... threads...
> PLEASE, do NOT pick at anything I said here as misplaced proof of me
> "not understanding" your issue...  I have better things to do than
> write a novel to cover every corner case anyone thinks I missed.
> Let's put this thread to bed...   OK? :)
> HTH,
> Pierre
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Actually i had no intention of responding to this thread anymore, but
such arrogance as writing a long email and ending by saying "Please
don't respond to all of this, please don't criticize me" is just too
I see two arguments in pierre's letter:
1. Some devs long ago might have chosen the way it is. 2. New users
might be confused or even do something wrong if we implement the other
1. is obviously no reason to let things as they are if we come to the
conclusion that another way looks more appropriate. It is, most of all,
no replacement for arguments in favor of the status quo.
2. is not convincing me. What pierre is imagining regarding a new user
is not a big issue. It comes down to knowing the difference
between a single email and a thread. After you deleted a whole thread
accidentally once, instead of an email, you will know the difference
even if you didn't know it before. You will notice that the difference
is visible. After you deleted the thread accidentally you will be able
to get it back, because you should be able to notice it at once and go
to the trash folder. This is not about moving whole folders, as pierre
was writing.

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