[Users] Claws config needs much better documentation

Sitaram Chamarty sitaramc at gmail.com
Wed Aug 1 21:03:03 CEST 2012

On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 11:58 PM, Holger Berndt <berndth at gmx.de> wrote:
> On Mo, 30.07.2012 22:47, Sitaram Chamarty wrote:
>>I'm glad it does a lot of things differently.  And I already said *I*
>>will no longer be affected by *this specific surprise*.  But that does
>>not alter the fact that it *is* a **bad** surprise.
> That's not a fact, no matter how often you try to sell it as one, or
> how much markup you use to try to make your point seem stronger. It's
> your personal oppinion.
> Conversely, you might want to consider to accept the fact that other
> people have different oppinions. It's also not really helpful to talk
> about "self-back-patting" and "gratuitous chest-beating" when you
> comment other users' points of view.

On the plus side, the email he wrote after that rant of mine did
finally discuss the actual issue and he actually made some good points
even if I don't agree with all of it.

> (Yes, you might not have realized it, but the ones that you accuse of
> self-back-patting and chest-beating are actually users, just like you,
> not developers. They just happen to have a different oppinion than
> you.)

What's your point?  At least part of the purpose of an ML is to trade
opinions.  I was trying to make a change that I felt would be very
useful based on an opinion.

[Note the word "was"]

> On a more general note: It's always nice to welcome new users into the
> Claws Mail community. It's also good if they bring up different points
> of view, because developers and long-time users might have developed a
> certain "organizational blindness" for certain aspects.
> On the other hand, newcommers can very well assume that not everything
> that works differently compared to their old MUA is a bug. Some things
> have in fact been done for a reason.

Some of the stuff that I find in claws is fantastic.  I tried claws
for speed, but I'm hooked on the quick search.  I'm actually thinking
of writing it up in some way.

I can even agree that you like this specific feature (i.e., message
view should not update when you move to the next message in the
message list).  I was not questioning the existence of the feature but
the fact that it is the default.

[Again, note the word "was".  I'm not going to discuss that specific
issue anymore; it's over and I gave up.  End of story.]

> Also, it can be assumed that Claws Mail doesn't strive to be a faster
> Thunderbird, or a better $INSERT_OLD_MUA_HERE. The reason that
> $OTHER_MUA does things in a particular way is neither a reason for
> Claws Mail to do it as well, nor is it a reason to not do it.

I already said that; in fact almost exactly those same words, because
some of the mails in the thread sounded like a religious "they all do
it that way so we should not".

But using expectations as a guide is not a bad thing.

> The issue with defaults is similar. You can very well assume that
> defaults have not been chosen randomly, but after some consideration.
> However, the primary goal is not to choose the option that makes Claws
> Mail resemble $OTHER_MUA as closely as possible.

I can only repeat what I said earlier: for 99% of the options you are
right but once in a while, it may not be.  Anyway, again, I gave up on
this so let it go.

> Of course, that doesn't mean that all defaults are perfect, and can't be
> challenged. On the other hand, not all challenges are convincing enough
> to get the default changed.


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